1 Nomenclature revisited No more than 5 mins or so on this From yesterday and subsequent feedback it is clear that many here are: From yesterday and subsequent feedback it is clear that many here are: –Keen to take this opportunity to try to progress this vexing problem –Keen to avoid foreign telephone numbers –Like the idea of simplicity –Appreciate the need to identify objects as PN associated with a particular galaxy It would be GREAT to take something away from this meeting It would be GREAT to take something away from this meeting

2 Assumptions Let us assume any host galaxy will ALWAYS have a name (even if we have to make up a new one) Let us assume any host galaxy will ALWAYS have a name (even if we have to make up a new one) Let us assume that any object can also have an alternative name associated with a given project or team – after all egos need to be catered for Let us assume that any object can also have an alternative name associated with a given project or team – after all egos need to be catered for BUT each object ALSO adheres to OUR new Universal PN Locator (UPL) for extragalactic PN BUT each object ALSO adheres to OUR new Universal PN Locator (UPL) for extragalactic PN Let us assume that the CDS will be happy with our preferred new UPL nomenclature Let us assume that the CDS will be happy with our preferred new UPL nomenclature As usual the devil is in the detail… As usual the devil is in the detail…

3 Problems Objects subsequently identified as contaminants Objects subsequently identified as contaminants –In a numbered scheme 1-n a removed object `m’ will leave a gap in what may been a nice ordered sequence –It does’nt matter! –Even in commercial data-bases such gaps are quite acceptable and common

4 Problem #2 Intracluster PN How do we name them? How do we name them? Some suggestions Some suggestions –Attach them to closest named galaxy –Include additional `IC’ to PN e.g. –PNIC-NGC or PN-ICNGC –Just have PN-NGC –Include the constellation in the name instead of a galaxy? –Where does a galaxy end and intergalactic medium begin? –Note any IC PN associated with free-floating GC’s or whatever would still work IF assume GC’s have a name

5 Problem #3 special cases They always crop up! They always crop up! We will not satisfy everyone with ANY adopted system We will not satisfy everyone with ANY adopted system There is probably no perfect scheme There is probably no perfect scheme If we are 90% there that would be a result. If we are 90% there that would be a result. So…………??? So…………??? PN-M31-1 to PN-M or PN-M31-1 to PN-M or PN GM31JHHMMSSss(s)+/-DDMMSSs(s) PN GM31JHHMMSSss(s)+/-DDMMSSs(s) Or something else? Or something else? We can decide We can decide

6 Observational challenges Q.A.Parker (Macquarie University/AAO)

7 The discussion…. Just a brief (relatively), simple pre-amble to get the discussion going Just a brief (relatively), simple pre-amble to get the discussion going In fact at this stage I rather like the idea of somewhat chaotic (not too chaotic) discussion In fact at this stage I rather like the idea of somewhat chaotic (not too chaotic) discussion Let’s see what might emerge before we settle down and consider more specific questions on Friday during Dick’s afternoon discussion session….. Let’s see what might emerge before we settle down and consider more specific questions on Friday during Dick’s afternoon discussion session….. So lets use this time to frame some questions for tomorrow and I’ll show some specific prepared questions from Dick at the end So lets use this time to frame some questions for tomorrow and I’ll show some specific prepared questions from Dick at the end

8 Fainter, Finer, Further, Faster Full coverage & Feory Technology Fainter Finer FurtherFaster Full coverage

9 Basic science PNLF as standard candle PNLF as standard candle PN as Dynamical tracers PN as Dynamical tracers PN as laboratories of nebula physics and comparison with theory PN as laboratories of nebula physics and comparison with theory Abundance variations and gradients within and between stellar systems Abundance variations and gradients within and between stellar systems Stellar evolution of low & intermediate mass stars Stellar evolution of low & intermediate mass stars PN-ISM interaction PN-ISM interaction And plenty of other stuff! And plenty of other stuff!

10 Technology This both dictates and limits what we can observationally achieve at any given epoch and in any wavelength domain This both dictates and limits what we can observationally achieve at any given epoch and in any wavelength domain It is at the HUB of the challenge wheel It is at the HUB of the challenge wheel It creates the spokes which enable us to tackle all these issues It creates the spokes which enable us to tackle all these issues Q: Are we driving it or is it driving us? Q: Are we driving it or is it driving us? –Can we influence design/instrumentation to suit our needs? What route are we taking on the science road? What route are we taking on the science road? This depends on who is behind the wheel and the quality of the map! This depends on who is behind the wheel and the quality of the map! This discussion is about trying to get a good map! This discussion is about trying to get a good map! Of course there are many drivers, in different cars some in the same race some on a totally different route altogether! Of course there are many drivers, in different cars some in the same race some on a totally different route altogether!

11 Technology Larger/multi aperture telescopes of all kinds Larger/multi aperture telescopes of all kinds Multi-wavelength capabilities from earth and space UV/Opt/IR/radio Multi-wavelength capabilities from earth and space UV/Opt/IR/radio Higher resolution capabilities Higher resolution capabilities More efficient/powerful detectors, spectrographs, interferometers More efficient/powerful detectors, spectrographs, interferometers Fibre/IFU/multi-slit technologies combined with narrow band capabilities, innovative techniques (e.g. nod and shuffle, tunable filters) Fibre/IFU/multi-slit technologies combined with narrow band capabilities, innovative techniques (e.g. nod and shuffle, tunable filters) The next big thing we have’nt thought of yet! The next big thing we have’nt thought of yet!

12 The Planetary Nebula Spectrograph

13 Do we want more of these? More with better resolution and wavelength coverage? More with better resolution and wavelength coverage? What about tunable filters that can rapidly image a series of diagnostic nebular lines over a wide field at a given redshift that can then be phased through the entire depth of a cluster…. What about tunable filters that can rapidly image a series of diagnostic nebular lines over a wide field at a given redshift that can then be phased through the entire depth of a cluster…. TTF on the AAT was a start but although a powerful and unique capability it has been de- commissioned TTF on the AAT was a start but although a powerful and unique capability it has been de- commissioned

14 The observational challenge…. AIM: To be able to obtain for external PN the kinds of observational detail we find in our own Galaxy: AIM: To be able to obtain for external PN the kinds of observational detail we find in our own Galaxy: –High S/N, high resolution spectra permitting accurate nebular parameters to be determined across a wide wavelength range –Accurate radial velocities/expansion velocities –High quality imaging (in lines) across a wide wavelength regime – data-cubes –Fine tune theory/models with detailed observations of diverse PN populations in widely different environments

15 Specifics Optical: IFU’s, FLAMES, GIRAFFE, 2dF etc Optical: IFU’s, FLAMES, GIRAFFE, 2dF etc Active and Adaptive optics (optical/NIR) Active and Adaptive optics (optical/NIR) New facilities: Spitzer, VISIR, CRIRES New facilities: Spitzer, VISIR, CRIRES Future facilities:SKA, OWL, JWST +++ Future facilities:SKA, OWL, JWST +++ Faster computers more powerful, precise and sophisticated n-body simulations and photoionisation codes Faster computers more powerful, precise and sophisticated n-body simulations and photoionisation codes What else do we want?? What else do we want??

16 Fainter IF we simply probe fainter via a combination of LGP, system efficiency gains, AO and exposure times we can: IF we simply probe fainter via a combination of LGP, system efficiency gains, AO and exposure times we can: –Push PNLF to limits is external galaxies at greater distance –Obtain higher S/N for more useful nebular diagnostic lines in our own galaxy, LMC and local group and perhaps begin to sample more basic lines in more distant galaxies –Abundance determinations in systems >10Mpc –Detection of halos, additional morphological features, lower surface brightness PNe…

17 Fainter…………. ID in PK catalogue followed up by Acker and removed New ID due to lobes being seen for first time - “the Wing-nut” –was a compact `point symmetric’ PN….

18 What you first see isn’t necessarily what you get

19 Nebula spectroscopy

20 Finer Resolution Both in imaging and spectroscopically and across wider wavelength domain Both in imaging and spectroscopically and across wider wavelength domain Ability to discriminate finer morphological detail Ability to discriminate finer morphological detail Measure accurate expansion velocities and systemic velocities in external systems Measure accurate expansion velocities and systemic velocities in external systems Reaction interfaces with ISM Reaction interfaces with ISM Removal of contaminants in spectra that were overlapping in lower res systems Removal of contaminants in spectra that were overlapping in lower res systems

21 PNe halos

22 Faster! We are truly entering an era of the data avalanche in many branches of science We are truly entering an era of the data avalanche in many branches of science AVO/Astrogrid initiatives to federate/incorporate/manage these massive petabyte catalogues, data points, images etc etc AVO/Astrogrid initiatives to federate/incorporate/manage these massive petabyte catalogues, data points, images etc etc Coupled with vast storage and processing capabilities as technology and Moores law allows Coupled with vast storage and processing capabilities as technology and Moores law allows We need to be able to handle/understand and disseminate results in a timely fashion and easily relate one sample to another We need to be able to handle/understand and disseminate results in a timely fashion and easily relate one sample to another In the PN field, particularly in the extragalactic domain, we will soon have tens of thousands of individual PN crying out for further study In the PN field, particularly in the extragalactic domain, we will soon have tens of thousands of individual PN crying out for further study

23 Further Problems Problems –Extreme faintness –Only visible as point sources in all but closest neighbours with current technology –Contamination

24 In distant PN we would like to: Detect/study Central stars Detect/study Central stars Detect/study Outer halos Detect/study Outer halos Detect highly evolved examples Detect highly evolved examples Determine PN morphologies Determine PN morphologies Determine nebular abundances Determine nebular abundances All in increasingly remote galaxies All in increasingly remote galaxies

25 Some desires picked up from this meeting –Badly need better/any spectra of PN candidates in Intracluster medium –Also need better simulations to leverage observations –Want to determine multi-dimensional PNLF’s –Want to detect central stars and directly determine spectral and photometric properties

26 A brief `hot of the telescope’ presentation Ortwin Gerhard

27 Specific Questions (Dick Shaw) these will be discussed on Friday afternoon What are the key scientific EGPN questions to address? What are the key scientific EGPN questions to address? What tools and techniques are needed to address them? What tools and techniques are needed to address them? Can these issues best be tackled by large collaborations? Can these issues best be tackled by large collaborations?

28 Should we aim for: Complete census of PN in Local Group to >5mags below peak L(5007)  understand origins of PNLF, late type populations, SFH Complete census of PN in Local Group to >5mags below peak L(5007)  understand origins of PNLF, late type populations, SFH Wide field imaging: FPA with selected filters or special imaging spectrographs (e.g. PN.S); IFU’s Wide field imaging: FPA with selected filters or special imaging spectrographs (e.g. PN.S); IFU’s

29 Can we perform: Morphological studies of complete samples of PN in at least 2 local group galaxies Morphological studies of complete samples of PN in at least 2 local group galaxies E.g. via HST/STIS or MCAO on 8m’s E.g. via HST/STIS or MCAO on 8m’s Census of intra-cluster PNe + velocities  understand galaxy dynamics, IC stellar population Census of intra-cluster PNe + velocities  understand galaxy dynamics, IC stellar population Wide field imaging (FPA) with narrow & intermediate-band filters Wide field imaging (FPA) with narrow & intermediate-band filters

30 Surveys Survey for Miras, Carbon stars in nearby galaxies Survey for Miras, Carbon stars in nearby galaxies Synoptic Time-domain surveys Synoptic Time-domain surveys UV spectroscopic surveys of the LG PNe to understand C production in late stages of stellar evolution  HST/STIS and any future UV space mission(s) UV spectroscopic surveys of the LG PNe to understand C production in late stages of stellar evolution  HST/STIS and any future UV space mission(s)